ouch it hurts!plz just read

1bassleft · Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:32 pm Post subject:

I just posted a shedload of text and it bummed off to the ether Evil or Very Mad

I don't blame moderators; I think my laptop got so bored reading my cack it sacrificed itself to save the community. Damned if I'm retyping, so here's a cutdown:

GL4eva, before you sand the whole bridge (it's plywood - difficult to sand) have a look at lowering the saddle. Here's a pretty decent site to look around:
http://www.frets.com/FRETSPages/Musician/Guitar/Setup/LowerAction/loweraction01.html

Also, look at the nut to make sure the strings are in their slots properly, and (I think the Esteban has a truss rod adjuster) that this is about right.

Lee, all my blurb went down the pan. Quick sum-up. I don't use the truss routinely to sort action and intonation, but I do look to see if it's OK first before meddling at the bridge. If the truss is out, you could be widdling saddles all week.

Gah, that's all folks. Nothing worse than the lost post Sad

lee_UK · Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 12:20 am Post subject:

im still not convinced bass, i would imagine bowing the neck forwards might make a teeny weeny gnats cock difference in the string length, so little you would need a nuclear scientist, and a 'laser' measuring device to calculate. Intonation is purely string length, and this on a conventional guitar can only be adjusted through the bridge, (maybe a little through the buzz freiten system which uses a specialy cut nut, and then usualy only concerns itself with the 'G' string.) Truss rod tweeking is for action.
What say you??

1bassleft · Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:08 am Post subject:

, Lee, I hear you. The funny thing is; I used to be a 'nuclear scientist' so that explains my anal posts Smile

Bear in mind, I'm saying that the truss rod needs to be set properly first, or else all your intonation efforts can be a waste of time. I'm not saying, "Intonation out? Just tweak the truss rod!" so we're not yards apart in POV (and hopefully not gnats-cocking our duelling pistols Wink

)

OK, blimey, this is difficult to do in a texty format. I think most are aware that the octave (12th) fret is midway between the nut and the bridge of the instrument. So, a Strat's 12th is about 12.75" from the nut and yer typical Precision's is 17" from the nut. If everything were ideal, the bridge saddles would be the same distance down the line and everything would be hunky-dory. Again, most people know that if you halve the string length, the frequency is doubled and you get the octave.

The problem is, fretted string instruments are non-ideal. The gauges differ, so your saddles are nearer the tailpiece for the low E and nearer the neck for the high E (or G, for the 4-stringers). Jumping slightly, if the neck's bow-wow, you won't be able to adjust the saddle length of each string to accommodate this. Also, as all know, the frets are not evenly spaced; they get tighter approaching the bridge to achieve the same semitone increment. This is where there the gnat's cock makes its entrance...

Imagine your strings run absolutely parallel to the fingerboard, and a gnat's flaccid cock's height above it. Then, you can do that open-string vs 12th harmonic setup and all the other frets will be fine too. If, however, your neck is bow-wow, the setup will (assuming you have the saddle-stretch) only make sure that your open and your 12th are an octave apart. Use a fancy tuner. The F will be OK, the F# too, then the G starts to veer to the red LED... by the time you get to the 7th fret, it's getting seriously pear-shaped.

This is a badly adjusted truss-rod. The reason for it is those piddling deviations from a horizontal line result in the Hz being skewed enough for the lugholes or even a tuner to hear that your "C" on the 8th fret isn't really a C. Even a Buzz-Lightyear can't correct for that.

Enough bad physics; anecdotal Oz stuff. I sold a righty-strung-lefty back to a righty. Could NOT get the intonation just right (new nut, saddles adjusted to the limit). It took a little 1/4 turn on the rod to sort it. Truss rods are there to be adjusted. Worse still, many people wing their allen key on the saddle height Crying or Very sad

. Even if you know the fingerboard radius, it's a real trick to adjust each saddle constantly to maintain the difference. That can be a real headache to correct.

1bassleft · Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:35 am Post subject:

Just had an idea for the insomniacs. Put a UK A4 or US legal paper sideways. You can draw a neck roughly to scale, and a string above it. First, do a decentish setup and run the string no more than 1/4" above the 12th and no more than 1/8" above the first. Now do the same with a real, comedy, bow-wow, curved neck. Mark the frets in their positions.

Compare the lengths and, hopefully, you'll get an idea of what I mean. I haven't tried it, so I might still leave you thinking I'm TOMA - Smile

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