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Beware of web sites that incorrectly identify fakes as real Gibson and Epiphone Guitars
Submitted by GSite_Editor on Fri, 07/24/2009 - 11:19.
A number of Web sites have cropped up that claim to be able to provide you with information about your guitar by plugging in its serial number. This has misled some guitar owners into believing that their counterfeit guitar is an authentic Gibson or Epiphone.
In fact, some counterfeiters or sellers of these fakes now even refer potential buyers directly to the web site in an effort to verify the “authenticity” of the fake guitars they’re peddling.
For example, one consumer recently forwarded Gibson’s Manager of Brand Protection Ric Olsen a craigslist.org posting, wherein a fake guitar was being sold as an authentic Gibson. The ad read: “I am selling this beautiful Silverburst Les Paul Custom. Please note that though the headstock says Gibson, it is NOT a Gibson, but rather an Epiphone. You can verify this by putting the serial # 08015553 into the following database: www.guitardaterproject.org.”
Web sites like Guitar Dater Project also claim to be capable of identifying Fender, Ibanez and Yamaha guitars.
Olsen wants to be clear that this site and others like it — intentionally or not — are perpetuating the counterfeiting epidemic, one that is built on this kind of misinformation.
With over 75 years of shipping records in the Gibson books, and dozens of variations on numerical schemes used across the years, decoding serial numbers isn’t an art that any one guitar aficionado — or piece of software — can undertake.
Ric Olsen says:
“Although Guitar Dater Project may correctly identify a guitar here and there based on historical data uploaded, it is a very unreliable way to truly identify and authenticate a Gibson or Epiphone guitar. I could give you a serial number from a fake right now, and you could enter it on this Web site, and it would tell you it’s a real Gibson or Epiphone. But it’s definitely not.”
Counterfeiters are taking advantage of Guitar Dater Project and other similar websites by sending in a bulk of fake serial numbers. This data is uploaded and subsequently appears to show that particular serial number as authentic.
The Guitar Dater Project says it “aims to provide you with the information hidden in your guitar’s serial number in plain English. It is a work in progress and is constantly evolving, much of which is due to user feedback.”
Olsen warns that there are some easy ways to detect an incorrect reading from the site:
“If you come across, say, a ‘brand new’ Gibson or Epiphone guitar, but the serial number tells you it’s anything older than one year ago, question it,” he says. “If you’re looking at a piece that is older than one year old and it’s being sold as ‘new,’ that’s a red flag because a lot of these fakes are coming with serial numbers that actually roll to a manufacturer date of up to five years ago or longer .”
Gibson has issued legal notices to the Web site to simply post a disclaimer but they haven’t responded.
The Guitar Dater Project is the work of the same man who, in 2005, ran a site advertising the downloadable “JPW Epiphone Serial Decrypter.”
The FAQ section of guitardaterproject.org reads: “I’m that guy [who invented] the JPW Epiphone Serial Decrypter … I decided to take the idea as far as I could but as I have been told many, many (many) times that the decrypter should have been a web application, that way no downloads are needed and all platforms are supported. Also this medium gives me added flexibility and room to try new things.”
The bottom line, says Olsen, is that “There are many entities that claim to be experts on the serial numbers of Gibson and Epiphone guitars, but the only advisable validation method is to contact our Gibson Customer Service department. Send it to us. It is that easy. And if you’re wanting a legitimate and quality new or used piece, find an authorized Gibson dealer.”
For questions about a guitar’s authenticity, contact the Gibson Customer Service team at service@gibson.com or 1-800-4GIBSON.
For more information on identifying a guitar by its serial number, click here.
Source: http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyle/Features/beware-web-sites-722/
Interesting .....
Hi,
When guitar site is warning about fakes and product numbers, why has guitar site a link to www.tradetang.com? I entered it and cannot believe that you can buy a Gibson Les Paul Standard for 200$ shipping included.
@ Cem A - Its a google ad they have no control over what it displays!
If the price is too good to be true,anything,guitars or otherwise should be examined thoroughly. In some ways this story is a double edged sword. The guitar brand most used in counterfeiting a Gibson is Epiphone. This is a positive for the latter being crafted so well as to fool the general public but a negative in the sense that its not a good enough mark to stand on its own merit. Not true.The difference between the two is that all Gibson's are made to such high standards all the time and while Epi has come a long way,the quality is still hit n miss.
I experienced this last year while shopping for an Epi silverburst custom. I played 6 different sbc's @ every music store who had one and they were all worth the asking price but one had them all cold. The thing is I knew what to look for,having played a real 78lp custom beforehand. Dont get me wrong there's no comparison, not even close but I realize that some people being suckered into these transactions dont have the same opportunity I had.
If it looks,sounds and most importantly feels good, do you're homework with Gibson,an authorized dealer and/or a qualified collector or luthier if possible but DO NOT rely on the guitardaterprojects of the world. Ive seen these copies on my local craigslist as well and as far back as I can remember,and well into the future, this will continue. Its a great thing to have busted such a large counterfitting operation and all involved MUST be held accountable.
I hope to hear updates as this case progresses.
Bravo Gibson for standing tall.
This story reminds me of the fake I came across at a local pawn shop. I've since stopped frequenting the place in question and stick to their more reputable competitor down the road. They tried to tell me that although the guitar had the Gibson logo it was actually an Epiphone and that they'd confirmed it by looking up the serial number. Naturally I was suspicious of this because I knew that nothing with the Gibson logo came from Korea. I'd never seen a fake Gibson before and honestly at the time wouldn't have known the difference but his story seemed strange so I steered clear.
Too bad I hear now that they are getting so good at the fakes that the only way to know for sure now is contacting Gibson directly with the serial number. Some people are actually saying that once you replace the electronics and the tuners they sound and play just as good. If that's true about the quality of the fakes getting to the point where the build quality is almost as good as the real deal, here's an idea to make it tougher for the rogue factories...find out who the luthiers are in the factories making the high quality fakes and offer them jobs with Gibby and additional training.:)
If the traditional guitar makers are serious about protecting their product name and quality so their guitars continue to hold value into the future, why don't they tag the guitars with an electronic chip that can't be copied? Genuine dealers could then have a OEM scanner that could verify authenticity for customers, even if this attracts a small fee, I think people would be keen to use it. Where someone is purchasing over the net or through advertising, a scan code number might be issued at the time of scanning and become part of the purchase documentation.
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