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She’s a beaut. I’ll be honest, when I opened the email yesterday and saw the pics, my heart skipped a beat and I started to get butterflies in my stomach. I can’t wait. Should be at my doorstep in less than 2 weeks.
(I posted the 6 previous pics as well in case there were others that wanted to see them)
http://i135.photobucket.com/albums/q127/shakedown_04092/Music%20Equiptment/IMG_1738-1.jpg
UPDATED PICS:
NOTE: They ended up using Cedar for the sides, which I was pretty psyched about (the original was going to be Mahogany) because of it’s strength and ability to finish & blend w/ Koa (the top & back).
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Hello Everybody I’m new to this site and this is my first post on here. Shakedown. I feel your pain I had a languedoc copy (from a different builder) that turned out to be a bust as well. My advice is to get rid of it and express your problems to a new guy who builds better replicas. I am writing this post because you gave a different builder you may get one from, I would encourage you to check out http://equatorinstruments.com/homepage.html This guy’s “mini” is basically a Languedoc. Load the pic’s of both side by side, even his neck joint is the same! I was thinking about getting one from him (I heard prices are extremely reasonable), but have recently decided that I don’t really want to play anything but strats. I’ve found my personal sound through them and really feel comfortable playing them. Anyway, Sorry about your guitar I know how it is to be really excited about a guitar only to be let down in the end, and feel ripped off. Hope this helps. Peace.
“Sharin’ The Groove”
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hey shakey i feel some of your pain, i had a Alembic Darling model made back in 04 and it was taking forever with constont changing on their part that delayed the guitar out more. hang in their brother your dream guitar will arrive when it does. i too love the guitar that trey uses and i am having a “mimi trey” being built now by a great luthier who prices out very affordable. i would like to see pics of what is wrong on the guitar from a person who has went down the custom build road before. here are some links to a couple of pics, cant figure out how to attach the pics so pleses take a look and let me know what you think…thanks ! OB
[IMG]http://www.seymourduncan.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=119&pictureid=618[/IMG] -
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Thanks for the responses guys, and definitely will keep you posted. Tim, you give me a lot to think about, and ultimately that is what I should do (send it back for a refund) because I agree with all your points; they should’ve never sent it out in the first place and should’ve done all that recutting, etc. But, aesthetics aside, it’s so hard to give up the one I have and will get to play for the next 8-12 months while the 2nd one is being built. That’s really what it comes down to, although it’s becoming more clear to me that maybe it shouldn’t.
I am awaiting one final conversation with them to clarify all the things that need to be clarified, so we’ll see where we go from there. I will say this – however this goes down is going to be on MY terms, no if’s and’s or but’s about it – and if they don’t agree, then that will defintely make the decision easy for me at that point: send it back and tell Andrew get to work.
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Okay, need to say this now…(and I’m a bass player with a £400 plank to my name)
But I’d take the money and go to the local guy.
Your post of the 4th and 1BLs considered views made me realise the idealism of letting a company who has proven they won’t clean up a string of glue unless they have to, build a dream insrument. I take more care than that fretboard recieved when I eat spaghetti (I hate messy food)!
Why did they cut wonky in the first place? (at GCSE I’d have had to recut that neck joint) and having cut wonky (we all do, TBF) why use it anyway and fill it with wood-filler?
Speaking of wood-filler that would be my final inspiration to lace up he Adidas, when you pay for hardwood why t f accept 2mm of, effectively, dust and resin?!
In short I’d run a mile…hard when you’re on first name terms and it’s a one/two man show….but sometimes people rely on that fact, and it’s the worst kind of deception…either way I hope you’re satisfied eventually and I haven’t just given you more to worry about!
Good luck,
Tim.
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Seeing as it was such a bespoke build, to your specs, I think I’d give them the benefit of doubting that this was some return lying around that they sent to you on the bounce. I just think that they knew about the build issues, and weren’t totally surprised when you spotted them.
As long as you’re keeping all the potential pitfalls in mind and clarifying them before proceeding, I think you’re covering yourself. Please do keep us updated on developments.
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1b/Lee/Tim
Thank you for your responses, much obliged, and keep them coming if you think of anything else that might be pertinant.
1b, thank you for bringing to light some other issues I hadn’t thought of yet, namely the expected wear-and-tear on the guitar I have in hand. I’ve sent the pics/email to them and they’ve responded, basically saying some things they can fix, others are a result of it being a “hand-made” instrument and not machine made, like some bigger companies, and other excuses I won’t get into here. I can accept some of that, others I need to clarify. And certainly your point of wear-and-tear is something I need to bring up in my next email. And the other thing you mentioned about them being so “easy” about building a new one – I found that suspicious too. I’ve wondered on more than one occassion if they actually built this guitar for someone else, who subsequently sent it back, and maybe they’ve been trying to get rid of it ever since, thinking they’ll slide it off onto an unsuspecting buyer. I certainly wouldn’t go accusing them of doing this because it’s simply not fair without any proof; all I’m saying is it’s one of many “possibilities” (however great or small) that have to be taken into consideration when examining this situation.
So long as they’re willing to abide by my requests of building the 2nd guitar, and that if I’m not satisfied the 2nd time around then we’re cutting ties, then I’m ok with letting them build another. I do LOVE how it sounds, which is what really kills me, in a way, because (obviously) I don’t want to have to send it back, but as you know at this price I have to.
I guess I have a few more emails/phone calls to make w/ them before getting to a solid jumping off point w/ them. Keep your fingers crossed for me.
I’ll keep you guys posted, for sure. Again, any other tips would be greatly appreciated.
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Shake, much as this thread is of help to you, we also owe you a big THANK YOU. The comments you’ve received are a result of your constant updates and appreciation of the POV of others. Many of us here dream, at least, of building/designing our ultimate guitar and some of us have taken a few steps that way. You’ve actually led us through the whole process; warts and all. Much more readable than those “my new axe awsomely rocks” types of posts.
Onto your position, though. I suppose your luthiers would have been criticized worse if they had played hardball, but I find it slightly strange that they agree to a new-build with so little argument. Almost as if they “hoped” to get away with sending it but realize they’ve been rumbled. I repeat, I understand they’re in a no-win-sitch either way, but I am surprised that they seemed to know your misgivings merely from an email or two.
Your alternatives are to return it for a refund or to play the guitar (sounds nice but bad cosmetics – and that’s important at this price level) until a replacement is sent. The 2nd option sounds fairly attractive (carry on playing until nirvana arrives) but I’d advise you to check thoroughly two very important points before agreeing to this.
1) Being optimistic, we assume that the replacement meets your expectations and you’re totally happy. What condition of “reasonable use” are they prepared to accept on the returned original? Surface scratches of the lacquer to front and back, fretwear, fretboard wear. If, for example, the binding starts to lift up after a coupla months, will they accept that this is a further result of bad workmanship or do they reserve the right to charge you for remedial work on return? Bottom line; letting you keep the guitar for a year is no benefit to you if you’re forced to keep it in its case for fear of extra payouts. Best to clear this with them.
2) Even more important, I’d like you to look into US consumer law. For the simple reason that I’m a British citizen so I don’t know if my rules are the same in your country, but here’s my reason for telling you to look up your alternatives. Here in Britain, brand new goods have to be of “merchantable quality”. Tricky definition, and sometimes has to be decided upon in court in the case of a dispute. However, most sellers prefer to avoid court like the plague and get you to accept repairs. I appreciate that your guitar maker is a small firm and not some corporate shark, but please read this and check if it has a similar effect on your own rights.
A British customer test-drives a new Ford demonstrator, likes it, and places an order. The new vehicle is delivered to him but it has “orange peel” paint finish, the driver’s door only shuts at the third attempt and it sometimes doesn’t engage reverse. He flatly refuses to accept it as being not of “merchantable quality” and demands his money back. The dealer offers to fix everything, lend him a car in the meantime etc etc. If the customer still refuses, the dealer might drag feet and ignore letters but, ultimately, the law is on the customer’s side. However, if the customer accepts the loan car and lets them attempt repairs, something strange happens. The car can eventually be punted back to him with a Jackson Pollack paintscheme, a door that only opens on Sunday and reverse is engaged by getting out and pushing the car backwards. In law, though, the customer has “accepted” the car and the dealer has made “reasonable” attempts to fix the problems. By all means, you can ‘phone those consumer TV programmes but, in law, you are in a worse position than if you had just thrown it back immediately.
Not saying this fits your jurisdiction and certainly not suggesting this applies to your guitar, but I’d feel better if you looked into your rights before agreeing to anything.
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Thanks for the honesty guys. It’s hard to swallow, but it’s what I need.
As for what to do, as of now I’m permitting them to build me another one. They were very apologetic (not sure what good that does considering the state in which it left their shop) and want to “make it right”, so when I gave them the option of either sending me back my money or building me a new one, they predictably chose the latter.
The hard thing for me at this point is that they’re allowing me to keep the 1st one (which sounds incredible, just the asthetics that are bad, as you saw) until the 2nd one is finished. It’s tough for me because I waited so long for this one, and it sounds great, so it’s hard to give up, even despite the issues, because I know if I go this route I’ll hopefully have the *right* one in about another year or so. This allows me to at least play this one until the 2nd one is done.
I have not sent the pics you have seen to them yet; I am awaiting a letter from them addressing the issues, agreeing to let me keep this one until another is built, and guaranteeing that if the 2nd one is still not up to par, to refund my purchase price in full.
Do you think that is a good move on my part?
I will be sending him the pics and he has vowed to pay extra close attention to these issues the 2nd time around, but again, I still have a little apprehension as to what that actually means, you know? I mean, how did this guitar leave their shop in this condition in the first place? And who’s to say the 2nd time around will be any better?
It’s either that route, or send this one back, get my money back, and have a local guy (who I have a LOT of faith in) build me the same thing. Problem with that route is that I go another year without my guitar. There’s a lot to think about here, and I appreciate any feedback/advice, it really means a lot that “strangers” (:D) are willing to take time out of their day to help me in such an important and emotional decision for me.
So THANK YOU. 😉
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Thanks for the pics Shake, i have to agree with you, as much as the guitar has the looks of a Bentley continental, it suffers with the build quality of a 1982 Lada with a DIY soft top conversion.
i would be up in arms at some of the scrappy work on that guitar, the bad binding, the bad neck join is just not on, you must have 30 faults on that guitar, if it were mine i would want my money back.What does everyone else think?
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You guys got emails? I can show you what I am talking about in a mass email. My new luthier (Andrew) took a number of pics for me to address all the concerns since his camera was far superior to mine.
Lee, I can see what we can do about a Sympathy, though honestly, I’ve never thought we covered it all that well. It’s quite a lot different than the original as well, but we’ll see.
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I genuinely think that your guitar is one of the best looking instruments ive seen in years, even the tailpiece matches the guitar, the curves are fantastic, the colour stunning, and have i said im in love with the double binding?
Saddened to hear about its construction, what exactly are the problems?
Put up a recording of Sympathy for the devil on your Myspace webpage.
I can see from a setlist you play it, would like to hear your version. -
Shake, really good to hear from you again, but what a saddening post 😥 I can honestly empathize with how you must feel. I can’t really give you any keep/fix/refund advice because, at this level, we’re not talking about issues that jump out a mile from a 17″ monitor. It obviously looks good from here but, if you can, talk some more about what was wrong in the detail.
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Whaddup y’all! Long time no write – been busy w/ the band and a new job but hope to not be too much of a stranger. My bad. Hope everyone’s been well and in good spirits. So we’ve posted some newer “live practice” clips on our myspace page (http://www.myspace.com/heavydime), so wanted to let you know. Gumbo (Phish) & Heroes (Bowie) are the new tracks w/ the new git. Let me know what you think if you want!
Unfortuantely….I am sending the git back. But not before they build me a new one and send it up. After bringing it to a local luthier here recommeneded to me by a couple of well respected guitar friends (very grateful for that) to address some concerns about the quality of construction, he confirmed what I had suspected which was that there were a lot of asthetic defects that a guitar costing this much money should not have. Needless to say, I contacted the original luthier to give him an option of either sending back my money (which I was then going to take and have this new found luthier – Andrew Olsen @ http://www.aoguitars.com, check his stuff it’s incredible) or building me a new one & I’d hold onto this one until it was done. It’s a shame really, because I am in LOVE with the tone and sound of this guitar, it’s perfect. It’s just there are too many flaws in too many areas (some very minor, some more than obvious) to accept. It’s quite devestating and heartbreaking, I’ll be honest, but what can I do? It’s just I waited soooo long and spent sooo much and my expectations were sooo high….and then to be let down was just awful. I was sick about it for a week or two, and it still gives me a pit in my stomach, but have since come to terms with it, and the original luthier was very apologetic and sympathetic to my unhappiness and offered to do whatever it took to make me happy, so I’m going on and banking on that.
I guess I didn’t realize it at first when I posted my initial reviews of it, but after a few days I started disecting it, and honestly became a little embarassed and taken advantage of about the issues since I had paid so much and got something that was less than what it should’ve been, which may explain one reason why I didn’t post my concerns/issues for a while. 😳
I wanted to get some of your opinions on this situation and what you might do or how you may handle it; it would mean a lot since so many of you have been so helpful in the past with me. Good/bad/ugly = all welcome. Come real. Some I talked to said send it back and get my money back asap because if he/they did injustice the first time around, who’s to say the second will be any better. Others say give him a second chance to make it right because he was apologetic and (seemingly) sincere.
Much obliged for reading this and any suggestions/opinions that are garnished here.
Thanks!!! 😉
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Well….
She had to be sent back unfortunately – 2 grounds came loose during shipping and I didn’t trust anyone else to fix it. She should be here early next week. Bummer, but what can you do?
She is gorgeous though – it looks like she should be on a wall or in a museum. It really is a work of art. From what I did play of her, it was like a dream. It will take me a little bit to get used to, as any new guitar would, but it felt like I was meant to have it, that’s for sure. Very light, as expected, and easy playability. The quality of it was pristine – they did a really nice job. I will post more pics (& hopefully audio) when she gets back. And the case they gave me for it effin’ phenomonal, it looks like a coffin almost! I half expected to open it up and see a Tommy Gun inside or something – it seriously looks like something out of a mob movie. Thing is a friggin’ beast I tell you. Rugged as all hell and custom made to fit the git.
Here are some pics I took that day:
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Yeah, I think I’m going to pass on the UGB for now, but they are sending it and the wiring schematics up to me anyways in the event that I want to have a tech install it in the future, which is cool. I guess it came down to the fact that I really couldn’t make a decision on it one way or another, so I figured better to not have it installed, test out the rig, then make a decision. I’ve also been briefed on sort of a UGB stomp-box that a guy I know on another forum makes for around $100, so that may be an option too. Sounds like a neat idea – not having it onboard and being able to engage it when I feel is necessary.
Anyways, I spoke w/ Pat this morning & he’s shipping it out tomorrow, should be here by Thursday, I hope. What this means is that I won’t be leaving the confines of my house – not even for a split second – until that thing gets here. 😆 I can’t wait! Can’t believe it’s actually gonna be here. I can tell I’m not gonna get much sleep this week….. 🙄
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Sorry I’m so late getting back to you, Shake. Have you come to a decision? Although I like an active preamp on my basses, they’re not so popular for guitar; perhaps for the reason the Resurrection people mention. As I mentioned in your previous thread, Nobels make floor units that would allow you to split your signal into dry/FX/both and buffer them if you wanted.
HST, it’s your guitar and if you use the pedal board as part of your rig, you may find it more convenient to have the control onboard. I think it’s a call you have to make based on your gut feeling.
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Thanks guys! Here are 2 more I just got today, all wired up ready to go! Not the best pics because they were taken at a weird angle, but still good enough. I am making (or trying to make) a decision about the Unity Gain Buffer and whether or not to install it. Here’s what Tim – the luthier – says about it in the email I just received:
[code:1]”A preamp is advised for long cable runs. This
would happen with many effects and a large stage. What it does is
give the effects unity gain. (or full signal were there is lots of
resistance). A pre amp does effect the tone of the guitar mostly by
giving it a higher output. (making the guitar louder but not exactly
as clean) A preamp also means a 9 volt battery. In my opinion
this guitar sounds great the way it is and the loop will work
effectively for your use with out it. The general leaning of many
of the guys using effect loops right now is to keep the guitar
natural (no pre amp.) There is also a few companies making and
outboard unity buffer so it is not in the guitar. Steve Kimmock is
one of the guys i first saw bypass the whole pre amp thing but still
have the loop. We just want to be sure before the guitar gets sent
to you. If you are good we will send. If you have questions please
shoot me a email. Thanks again.”[/code:1]So I guess I’m leaning away from installing it, though my onl question, which I’ll ask him when he calls back in 10 minutes, is whether or not it would be beneficial in my circumstance. I don’t have 50 foot cable runs, but I do have 10 FX on my pedal board.
What do you guys think?
Here are the pics:
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What up y’all? Been a while, which means I haven’t had anything usefull to add, but I did get some updated pics of the guitar, so I figured I’d pop in and say whaddup.
The first 2 are mine, awaiting the installation of the pups/UGB/electronics – the only thing left as of now is the UGB, so there’s a chance it may be here by the end of the week! The next 3 are of some other gits they’re doing. I can’t wait to get her….she looks gorgeous, no? Love the look of the Koa’s grain through the finish & stain. I think they’ve done a mighty fine job. Will MOS DEF post pics & audio when she gets here. Been trying to think of a name for her, but maybe I’ll just leave her blank. Can’t decide. Not really a big deal, after all. Enjoy!
These next 2 are of a “Wolf” replica (Jerry’s guitar in the mid 70’s) they’re doing for some guy:
This last one is of a “Hollowbody Bolt” they’re doing for some other guy:
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[quote]I don’t usually like those kind of odd shaped headstocks[/quote]
I don’t usually go for blue-coloured fretboards, myself, but I’ll forgive anything in this case.
Although I don’t like the spikey body of the Lightning Bolt, it’s the best of its type I’ve seen. I also like thru-necks and never understood why they’re not more common on lead guitars. A top cap hides it, if the aesthetics are an issue.
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A guy I know on another website wanted me to post pics of the guitar that Resurrection is making for him. It’s a Steve Cripe replica, called the Lightning Bolt. Steve Cripe is the luthier who made Jerry Garcia’s last 2 gutiars – Lightning Bolt & Top Hat. Absolutely gorgeous. Here are the specs (that I’m aware of) & the pics:
-5 Piece Body- Rosewood / Maple / Walnut 9 Piece Neck- Rosewood / Maple / Walnut
-Nitrocellulose Lacquer Finish
-2-Way Truss Rod
-Indian Rosewood Fret board with Iveroid Binding
-25.5 Inch Scale 1 5/8 @ Nut 2 1/8 @ 24th Fret
-24 Frets / Size 6120’s
-Dot Inlays
-Corian Nut
-Black Gotoh Tuners
-Black ABM Bridge
-Schaller Stop Tail
-3 Dimarzio Super II’s with Coil Tap Pick-ups 1 Volume / 2 Tones CAE Sound CB1 Pre Amp with FX Loop
-Lightning Bolt Cover Plate
– he’s also having a MIDI isntalled behind the cover plate
– the back, headstock, and fretboard are made with some of the last pieces of the original Jerry opium bed woodIt’s a beaut.
And here’s a general idea of what it’ll look like finished:
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She’s all Koa (hawaiian) on the front & back, Cedar sides, Piece Flame Maple / Rosewood Neck, Custom Rosewood Bridge (not seen in above pics), Mother-of-Pearl Vertical Inlays, Corian Nut, Ebbony Fretboard, Chrome Schaller Tuners, Custom Ebbony Trapieze Tailpiece (also not seen, but VERY sweet looking – modeled after pieces similarly seen on European cellos), 24 frets, 2 Schaller Golden 50’s Pick-ups, 1 Volume / 1 Tone / 3-Way Switch w/ Series Parallel Switches. I am also having them install an FX loop bypass jack/switch with a Unity Gain Buffer so I can bypass the pedal board altogether.
Above pics, Left to right: Tone & Volume are above the F-hole, and underneath are the FX bypass switch, series parallel switches, and the 3-way selector switch.
Here’s a basic idea of what it should look like when finished:
She’s being built by a father/son team in Florida that own an outfit called Resurrection Guitar Company. They originally were a repair/restoration shop, but got into building some time ago, and make some BEAUTIES (http://www.resurrectionguitars.net). The guitar is actually very closely a replica of one that is made by Paul Langeudoc (Phish’s soundman, and the same luthier who made Trey Anastasio’s 3 guitars), with a few tweaks here and there, so I can’t take credit for the design, nor can they for that matter, sans the fact that they do all the work and don’t have patterns, etc. to work from (other than their own).
You know what I’m looking forward to? The tone, and the incredible sustain.
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