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Thanks 1bassleft, for your welcoming my sharing, and to not get bent out of shape by various comments of others, regarding writing, etc.
No, your mention that my tuners wouldn’t be vintage wasn’t taken badly by me. I appreciated your knowledgeable input, and the input by various others on the topic of tone, what matters and what doesn’t.
I’m glad for that mention someone had about the various visually challenged people who read these… I hadn’t thought about that, but will keep that in mind.
I personally think that there’s lots of things that can affect ‘tone’ to some degree or not, depending on your ears, what type amp, settings, what date your grandparents came to America, and so on. (Some may or may not)
When something changes in your tone, it’s easy to backtrack and see if you changed something recently (strings, springs, neck relief, and maybe tuning machines possibly).
In some recent reading I’ve done regarding tone, trying to learn more about it, so as to get more from my instrument(s), there seems to be so much controvery by the ‘experts’, famous guitar technicians, like Buzz Fieten and his Fieten Tuning system for the guitar, that I understand Washburn is equipping some of their guitars with.
He (Buzz Fieten, per Dan Erlewine’s book on setting up your guitar), Fieten seems to think that a negative neck angle and/or putting a shim or two between the neck and body (in the neck cavity, but on the tuning peg edge of the cavity) will give a guitar better ‘tone’, Buzz Fieten suggesting or implying something regarding that ‘separation of the neck and body’, that the body and neck each have their own vibrational frequencies, their own tones, etc., so he believes in shimming and negative neck angle…
…But then of course, on the flip-side of the coin are the others who want to have a tight bonding of the neck to the body, the tighter the fit the better, hopefully without shims, and what Dan Erlewine in his book(s), and so many others tend to agree on, that “good coupling” contributes to good vibrational frequency transfer, better sustain, better tone, etc.
I’m not going to bother with shims unless I have to with my strat, and think I agree with Dan Erlewine on that. After all, isn’t that why certain set neck guitars are preferable than their bolt on versions of the same, for tone, sustain, etc.?
I’m liking my mexi strat more each day 😆 Happy plinkin’
To MrBlanche. Glad I paragraphed this 2nd submittal (so as to not be in the Monsieur Pavee…Mr. Paving Stone! category).
Yes, paragraphing, and condensing info can be challenging to some, and is certainly something I need to work on, but at least I know now of others’ difficulty reading that 1st big block of text I sent. Sorry ’bout that.
Thanks for the reminder though, without getting nasty at me.
Harsh criticism usually isn’t necessary, but gentle reminders or mention as you (and others did) is nice, and usually would get better results than jumping on someone’s case, or name calling, so thanks for the civil mention, so I can try to improve and not be lumped into that Monsieur Pavee…Mr. Paving Stone category.
Happy playing.
Sorry glw about too big a block without paragraphs…
and thank you to 1bassleft for your nice input back regarding my tuners on my Mexi Strat. Since they’re not so likely to be any vintage, I won’t be so hesitant to replace them then, but…
Regarding my tuners, I was reading about the difference tuners can make with tone, see “How to Make Your Electric Guitar Sound Great” by Dan Erlewine.
According to that book, the heavier the tuners, the ‘darker’ the tone tends to be, and the lighter the tuners, the more ‘chimier’ the tone.I like the chimeyness of the tuners I have, but lack a ferrul on one, so likely will try replacing that (guitar’s new to me, used), and if it tends to be a tuning hassle then, I’ll replace the tuners, but will try to go with something light, so to keep the chimeyness it has.
Back to about the weight of tuners affecting the tone though,…Here are the weights of popular tuners, not necessarily strat, but for others too, Les Pauls, etc., too…
Grover Rotomatic 8.8 oz.
Schaller M-6 7.7 oz.
Gibson/Schaller M6 8.6 oz.
Kluson Deluxe 3-on-a-side, (plastic keystone knob) 4.8 oz.
New Kluson 6-in-line 5.9 oz.
Gotoh Kluson Locking Tuner 4.95 oz.
Old Kluson 6-in-line 5.0 oz.
Sperzel 5.4 oz.
Grover Imperial 10.3 oz.Note, per that book by Dan Erlewine (which I’d recommend highly, named above): Lighter, brighter authentic tone was said to be the result of someone replacing their Les Paul tuners with new Kluson-style tuners, rather than the heavier Grover Rotomatics that someone else had replaced the originals with.
Seems the info is hinting at all guitars though, Strats included, the lighter the tuners, the lighter, brighter the sound, the heavier the tuner, the darker… so, depending on what sound is sought by the owner, hopefully the above weights of popular tuners and relative info I came across will be of help.
In replacing tuners, the height of the tuning post, and hole, can affect the string angle. Generally more angle seems desireable, but then again, that can affect whammy bar with the strings being possibly more apt to hang up on the nut, depending on what type nut.
I have some tuners (on another guitar) I’m thinking of replacing mine with, but think their lower post height would create too big a string angle from the nut, creating drag when whammying (standard mexi strat nut), so might just try to get a ferrul to replace my missing one, or perhaps replace the tuners with higher posts than what I happen to have, not sure what brand, but seems a light-weight to keep the chime.
Don’t mean to be so verbose, sorry, but at least I paragraphed, okay glw? Thanks again much, 1bassleft, and others. Hope this info is useful to some of you. ~GitBoxKurt
This post had been a reply to someone named Rob, regarding his worry about a Fender Stratocaster Phoney?, but the forum had reconstructed, so will post this here, with the remember the Alamo stuff, US vs Mexican Fenders, as this pertains to that, my reply, and my recent purchase of a used Mexi Fender Strat, as follows, for Rob, but for whoever else here, too, Fender Statocaster, American -vs- MexicanRegarding this Re: Mexican Stratocaster Phoney? issue… I recently picked up one of these babies that have the big Fender Logo, made in Mexico, and smaller Squire Series Logo on the rounded part of the headstock. It has a nice rosewood fretboard, does have those cheap looking tuners compared to the other Mexi Strats I’m seeing, but didn’t Strat-Man say that those are maybe vintage tuners? I hope so. I got mine used, and one of the tuning posts is lacking a ferrul or washer so it rubs against the post’s hole, that one. There aren’t nuts on the top of the tuner to tighten it up to the peghead, so maybe they’re cheapo, maybe they’re cool vintage tuners? Mine is red, has a great rosewood neck, staggered pickup pole pieces on all 3, nice whammy bar, works nice. Tone is good, but still experimenting. I think I could get to really liking this guitar once I adjust the pickups, intonation, springs, etc., a bit better, and the volume pot definitely needs replacing, but might try some TV cleaner spray, but think it needs a new vol pot, and possibly tone pots too. Otherwise a sweet axe it could become I think. Neck feels great! Rosewood board on it, and it has a stripe down the back. I was going to try to ‘upgrade’ the tuning pegs, but if Strat-man is right about them maybe being vintage Klusons(?), I’ll maybe just try to track down a ferrul for the one tuner that’s missing that, as heavier tuners can ‘darken’ the tone, and I like the sound this one’s making. It just needs a little work. I pretty much got this axe for a song, a package out the door deal for it and a nice newer Crate amp with chorus and reverb, from a pawn shop, and with a gig bag and the whammy bar too. Just needs the pots and the ferrul and some new strings and I hope to be whaling. I hope the tuners are vintage, not some cheap garbage. I haven’t played it enough to know if they will stay in tune or not. Maybe they’re a little worn too, though. Hope this is of some help, at least letting someone else know that I have a recent purchase that fits into what was considered by someone else as being possibly a Mexican Stratocaster Phoney. Would like to play this through a better amp though, once I get it tinkered with. I think it’s probably many times better than the Chinese Strats though. I can feel that fact, just by holding it, how the neck feels. It’s got some character. I’ve owned other guitars, and still do have others, so I’ve had quality guitars in comparing this one, a USA Strat HM, a Fender Solid Ash Tele Plus w/lace sensors, a SRV strat, a Fender Santa Rosa, Gretch Atkins Axe ’78, Gibson ES-135 w/P100’s, a Les Paul copy (great copy, possibly Cort), Hohner Steinberger copy, Arbor headless Stilleto, and a few more, so you know I’ve had some nice tuners, pickups, necks, sounds, etc., but even with that, this Mexi Strat with the Cheap looking tuners seems like it might be a decent guitar, and not just because I got it cheap either. Mainly hoping the tuners aren’t garbage, but are maybe vintage, and I can get the pots replaced. Otherwise, I like the feel of this axe, and think I’ll actually like it better than my SRV that I sold, and maybe my USA HM strat I sold (though it was a great neck, but I like the chimeyness of this Mexi model, compared to the darker HM sound, though I’d love another HM any day. Hope this is helpful to other Fender Mexican Stratocaster owners out there that have a Large Fender Logo, along with Made in Mexico, but also the smaller logo on the rounded part that says Squire Series, as mine says. Any more ideas on these cheap looking tuners, are they junky or are they vintage, before I replace something I’ll regret later, if they’re actually vintage and just need a ferrul and perhaps some cleaning to stay in tune, etc.? Any input for us with these Fender Stratocasters from Mexico that say Squire Series on a smaller logo on the rounded area, would appreciate any experience or knowledge, just as I’m trying to do for the person who wondered if there’s was a Phoney or what. I kind of like mine, but have some work to do on it, so any wording regarding such a model would be helpful, as I have hope that this can be a decent axe I got recently. Thanks. GitBoxKurt
