Everything in life is based upon perspective and from this our own individual maps of the world are shaped. I fully appreciate that those things that challenge those beliefs are difficult to deal with on many levels, hence you ignore every salient point, every question, in fact everything that could have ended this weeks ago. I realize the questions and points I raise are difficult to tackle head on, therefore all the sidestepping and stonewalling.
This is the complete reverse of my own approach whereby I deal with your responses, quote you directly and supply answers – you seem to have trouble with that and I can only surmise that people don’t like their output being deconstructed so methodically.

I ‘go on and on’ only because you refuse to tackle my core point with any type of thought-through response. Not once have you or any of your cohorts attempted to supply any corroborating evidence to support your view – – you have intimate knowledge of the way audiences think and they perceive riffs as a blur – so case proven?? I must conclude my point about the strobe light hit home as this has been ignored.

You believe my posts are intended to highlight my being cleverer? Isn’t that usually the result of someone being compromised into feeling that? This is just me being me – but if that is what you feel, thanks you for the compliment but it is unnecessary.

You broached the subject about dual personality by saying you weren’t going to mention it BY mentioning it! You completely ignore the point I made about IP addresses – allowing people to carry on believing I could be FB – if you believe that is justified and not worthy of a response, then okay. I understand your need to help defuse any bad press in Lee’s direction from a third party.

You are ones who apparently need lots of brow soothing for literary indiscretions. If you need apologies to help readjust your internal state, then I apologise profusely to everyone concerned, being called a ‘twit’ must indeed wound the ego.

As for peddling my bike, you have had countless opportunites to deflate the tyres, but you seem more intent on handing me a pump.

You finish by asking me not to ignore ‘the point’ where your entire two posts have done that very thing.

I wonder why the new Line 6 pedals are called ‘Tone Core’?

Following a week of night duty, (plus two long mornings in court), then four days away in Cornwall, I have only just sat in front of my domestic server and even thought about seeing how this had all panned out.
I guess I didn’t make it clear that my job severely restricts my access, let alone desire, to visit websites. Stating my occupation had nothing to do with gaining respect, merely that I work shifts and I would not be around much once back at work, so posts designed to ‘draw’ me out where simply redundant.

So everything was all a big joke? Well of course we all know that it certainly wasn’t a joke, even poor Michael backs this up succinctly. He says, ‘Opinions are divided straight up the middle… and I’m thinkin’ it’s gonna stay that way’. Aren’t jokes supposed to be made up? If it is a joke then how can Michael believe half the people accept Lee’s 90/10 claim as true!

We all know it was no joke, Lee spent ages hedging before responding, no-one sprang to his defence or offered up supporting evidence. He finally cobbled together a load of techniques and made up figures believing that by adding this all together would somehow prove himself right. Even those musical passages that did not include a single hammer-on, the reader was asked to accept would be included in the math. Lee asked for my concise response, this I supplied pointing out that the effect of each technique was not cumulative and Monkey Boy was nuked in one hit!
Realising his water tight deliberations were simply a colander, he tried to convince everyone that it was all a joke and lots of masonic back slapping and rank closing ensued intended to minimise embarrassment.
It is a great shame that this latter act was forced to arise as it greatly compromised everyone handcuffed to Lee’s bedpost by association.

I accept you know a lot about your subject Lee, but we all make mistakes and all you have succeeded in doing is confusing people, extremely evident by the above posts. You are the literary equivalent of Spinal Tap, someone posts something and you must take things not to ‘one louder’, but ‘one better’. It is the way you are, the way you operate, we are all different and I accept that. However this environment is very useful for those who want to increase their knowledge, have an interesting debate or simply shoot the breeze, BUT the moment you try covering a mistake that everyone can clearly see is incorrect (no supporting evidence by one person/a site address), your credibility plummets.

For those who are still confused;

A guitarist’s fretting hand can only alter the pitch of note by bending or shortening the strings. This is technique and not tone.
A guitarist’s picking hand can only influence the loudness of a note by how much attack they implement, with pick, fingers (or sixpenny piece). This is technique not tone.
Tone is solely the domain of what equipment you use, the guitar, the amp, the cables, the strings, the pickups and you will not sound like Gary Moore, BB King, Dave Gilmour or whoever, until;

a) You own their identical rig
b) You play in a 100% identical style

This post is not intended to be inflammatory or provocative. I neither have any intention of shouting to the rest of the forum in upper case that Lee is unable to admit his mistakes by opening a thread with that in the title. I accept you know a lot about your subject Lee, but we all make mistakes and all you have succeeded in doing is confusing people, extremely evident by the above posts.
You are indeed the literary equivalent of Spinal Tap, someone posts something and you must take things not to ‘one louder’, but ‘one better’. It is the way you are, the way you operate, we are all different and I accept that. However this environment is very useful for those who want to increase their knowledge, have an interesting debate or simply shoot the breeze, BUT the moment you try covering a mistake that everyone can clearly see is incorrect, your credibility plummets.

Try gaining some humility, you will be a lot better person for it.

[quote=”rayc”]I couldn’t resist the jibe. I don’t see what you were getting all worked up about. If you are right, then what difference does it make if someone disagrees? If his arguments are weak or non-existant, then all the better for your side. It seems to me that you wanted to hear someone say “uncle.”

I think it is silly to apply percentages to this kind of stuff. What you are calling ‘tone’ is something separate and distinct in my mind from technique and style. It is what one looks for when choosing and configuring equipment. So, I think I agree with you, to some extent. However, I also think that technique and style contribute as much or more to the overall sound. I think that one is more likely to sound like Clapton if one plays with similar technique and style on much different equipment (but not a banjo) than one is if he plays the exact same setup without the technique and style. I can’t put a percentage to it.[/quote]

From your join date, I’m more inclined to believe you are 1bassleft, who, not wishing to compromise his good relationship with Lee by expressing his real opinion, has simply joined under another name.

[quote=”rayc”]Oh the “twit” was an insult? I thought it was a signature.

Well I have to get back to playing Layla on my sister in law’s banjo. Sounds just like Clapton (would sound if he was me and playing a banjo).[/quote]

Yes, I can appreciate how you would get confused easily. Banjo players can’t work with more than four strings.

[quote=”lee_UK”]Its in the fingers youngwasp, and its 90% maybe even more, maybe 95%.
heres the breakdown

1. Pick action 12.45%
2. hammer ons 7.55%
3. hammer offs 10%
4. string bending 10%
5. string muting 10%
6. palm muting 10%
7. grinding the strings with the pick 2.5% (not including wrist action)
7a Trem arm control 7.5%
8. roll on’s 10%
9. roll off’s 10%
10. rocking the 3/5 sway switch backwards and forwards 5%
11. chorus-flanger, delay, reverb, sustain, and every other effect 5%

dont forget, please leave the dictionary alone when you reply, and please no 600 word quotes ” “, you will obviously need the calculator, so get tapping and them come back to me with a sharp concise response.[/quote]

You complete and utter plonker Lee – the things you list above aren’t CUMULATIVE.

Yes, I agree 100% that a hammer on will influence tone 10%, but that leaves 90% for your equipment. The effect of the hammer on is then not ADDED to that of the palm mute two bars later then the next hammer on. What you’ve typed above has simply endorsed EVERY word I’ve said.

Twit.

I fully understand your confusion now, you are unable to seperate technique from tone.

Ok.

I have made my position as clear as it could possibly be – equipment produces 9/10ths of tone.

I have viewed perhaps 15 – 20 guitar sites that detail what guitar note is, what constitutes it and how it is achieved. EVERY SINGLE ONE without exception says exactly what I say.

You continually say otherwise and not once have you even attempted to supply one iota of detail, despite opportunity after opportunity. Like a Christian who ‘believes’ who is pressed to say supply details, no-one comes up with an answer as to what = nothing. ‘It’s all in the fingers’, is the glib response every time.

I too say that a pedal will NOT make you sound EXACTLY like any named guitarist, it being an approximation given the obvious variations of variables in the chain, guitar, pickups, strings etc etc, of the original.

What is very common is that you raise a point and when I respond you seem to forget/ignore that you initially raised it;

Lee said in the other thread;
‘And what you fail to understand is, it’s only you me and Bass that are reading this thread,’

I said;
‘Exactly 48 hours ago the views held steady at 153, today, now, at the time of writing = 289.
The numbers unfortunately disprove your theory. Sorry.’

Then I am accused of;
‘Saying that 300-whatever people have viewed without posting; ergo, they all agree with you – that’s one way of looking at it.’

Complete pants, I merely pointed out that it clearly was not ‘you me and Bass that are reading this thread’ – in fact the number stands now at 350. I did not say or imply anything about agreement whatsoever, JUST that 100’s of people were viewing the thread.

My position could not be clearer, I agree that a small percentage of guitar tone is evoked with the fingers in conjunction with the pick and have supplied copious detail, not just based upon my belief system but many others too.
Your position is clear too. You say one thing based upon a percentage you supplied, i.e. the fingers provide 9x more influence over tone than equipment. I ask you to detail what the fingers do that produce that? Nothing is supplied whatsoever, not one scrap, no tiny morsel of an idea or notion, zippo, zilch, just days of rhetoric, squirming and cries of being bored.

You now want to ‘…..take it bit by bit.’? You’ve already had the chance to do that in spades.

Well, quite simply no thanks. You are backed into a corner of your own making and it is up to you to get out of it – and no way is it a case of we simply disagree, I have supplied masses of detail, you have not supplied any.

Start supplying details of the magical 9x finger power, or you are blethering amongst yourselves.

The viewers of this entire situation await you to ‘put up, or shut up’ – there is no ‘bit by bit’.